Fish stocking environmental impact?

[Hooked Up]

KABC news reports the California Department of Fish and Game possibly stopping the stocking of fish in privately owned lakes! Like Irvine/Corona/SARL etc. The State might also require a California fishing license to fish these lakes!? While Most FNN'ers have their state licenses, the DFG does NOT stock these privately owned lakes! More info. on FNN homepage. @fishinglakes.com. The DFG says it's about "environmental impact"_I think it's about $$$$! What do you think? Sorry if this has already been posted before?

[P.A.W.]

Well, if they will allow stocking to continue AFTER all the liscencing fees etc. have been ponied up, then it can be nothing else other than money.

[RTG]

Those private lakes are on the state water system. State water flows in and out of those lakes. They don't own the water therefore they have been getting away with not requiring fishing licenses for years. They have an "aquaculture permit" even though they don't raise their own fish. Sorry boys...time to pay the piper. By the way, this all came about by the lawsuit from the Center For Biological Diversity. So it ain't about the State making money.

[TheAsianGuy]

RTG is smacked on the head! It's about the State monitoring the high BOD, TSS, TDS, TOC, nitrates, and TPH from the privately owned lakes. Sorry to go technical on you guys. Aquacultural licenses only pertain to the discharge of pollution related to the fisheries. However, there are more coming off the privately owned lake than just the fishery's pollution. That's why DFG is so hard butt on state licensing mandate for all privately owned lakes. The money is not for the stocking of fishes. The money is for cleaning up the messes privately owned lakes (the bad ones) caused.

[Bassmaster Bob]

Maybe this will force these lakes to lower the price and I can actually go and try them, since there's no way I'm paying their current prices.

[seal]

Maybe this will force these lakes to lower the price and I can actually go and try them, since there's no way I'm paying their current prices.

Huh? Sorry Bob prices would go up not down.

[DarkShadow]

Those private lakes are on the state water system. State water flows in and out of those lakes. They don't own the water therefore they have been getting away with not requiring fishing licenses for years.

Looks like I'll be having to purchase my fishing license every year now. :-( Aww shucks.

[TheAsianGuy]

Looks like I'll be having to purchase my fishing license every year now. :-( Aww shucks.

Well, a fishing license will expand your horizon to fish other locations..rather than doing DarkShadow's ninja modes all these years..you can be called LightShade from here on in Is that nick taken?

[sapdawg11]

Here's the deal, as quick and dirty as I can make it:

The "Center For Biological Diversity" is an eco-litigous group meaning that they make their money off of suing people, companies and the government for "environmental oversights". While protecting endangered species and sensitive habitats is without a doubt critically important, we are talking about a group behind many of "those" nightmare stories that you read about. Someone being sued and losing their home over a "possible" sighting of a kangaroo rat, the EPA rolling over in frivolous lawsuits and losing millions of your tax dollars, etc. etc.. This is a really well-known group not for what they do for the environment, but for their constant leaching off of the system and only settling when their pockets are fully lined with fresh new bills (over $1.1 MILLION in "legal settlement" in 2009 alone!). These are not good people. These are not "patrons of the environment". These are money hungry lawyers under the veil of a "green" name with an agenda focused only on an entirely different kind of green...money!!! Think I am lying or exaggerating? Then go ahead and read these articles...

Writers on the Range: Extreme green

Chilton Ranch Lawsuit

more background to Chilton Ranch Lawsuit

And there are many more stories just like those!!! It's truly unbelievable and it absolutely PAINS me to think that my tax dollars are being spent to feed these leaches. Ridiculous.


The CFBD originally sued the DFG noting that while farm raised fish having a negative impact on endangered species had never been documented, hatchery raised fish pose an inherent, unnatural risk to endangered and protected species in the surrounding areas and that this risk needs to assessed and mitigated if necessary. This includes both the time the fish spend in the hatchery as well as the time they spend in the bodies of water in which they are planted. Water quality is not at all the issue here. After filing the initial lawsuit, the CFBD subsequently included private hatcheries, private lakes, and just for s___s and giggles, they also decided to make it a sweeping rampage that would include ANYBODY that maintain fish in their lakes into the lawsuit. It's not just Irvine/SARL/Corona/LNL. It's Perris, Silverwood, DVL, Skinner, Barrett, your local golf course, AND YOU!!! Have a pond in your backyard with fish in it? Well, you'll have to hire a certified biologist to come onto your property so that he/she can do an environmental assessment. If he/she finds that in ANY way, your pond interacts with an endangered or protected species (think about what "interacts" means and you'll see that its a very loosey goosey term that lawyers can have all kinds of fun with), you'll be subject to further assessment and perhaps having to mitigate. Mitigation may include draining your pond or killing your fish, OR, even better, it could include now having to care and set up a permanent mitigation site on your property!!! Do all of that, and yup, YOU'LL STILL NEED A FISHING LICENSE TO FISH IN YOUR OWN BACKYARD!!!!! Not to mention that DFG will be welcome on your property whenever they wish for "inspection" and nope, they won't be stocking any fish. You better not be fishing with more than 2 rods (and you better have a stamp for the second one. You can keep all of your license stuff in the kitchen drawer and grab it when they come knocking!)!!!

But maybe you're like me and you don't own a pond. You may be thinking, "Well, I buy a license every year and I don't mind paying a few extra bucks to go fish at a pay lake" right? WRONG! This is NOT a simple "raise the prices at the gate" type situation. A survey conducted during this process showed that more than 60% of pay lake attendees do not have a fishing license! If even half of those people stayed home because they had to purchase a license for mom, dad, grandma, grandpa, etc., your favorite pay lake will be forced to close it's doors. And then you can throw on top of that the insane assessment and mitigation fees and really drive in the nail in the coffin. This is without a doubt a "businesses shut down and ALL California stocking programs are shut down" type situation. And that would be a best case scenario. Imagine, with the state budget being the fiasco that it is, that Lake Perris, Silverwood, or any of those bodies of water that we all love to visit are now hit with a 1-2 punch of: 1) they need to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on biological assessment and possibly millions on mitigation and 2) the fish that they used to plant are simply no longer available. Thinking about what that would do to the southern California fishing scene sickens me. I can't even begin to picture it and I really would rather not.

This really is a big deal and can absolutely be thought of as freshwater fishing's version of the MLPA. Everyone that can be, needs to be involved as this will potentially hit not only the pay lakes, but everyone involved in this industry from tackle shop owners, manufacturers and without a doubt, anglers. I'm outraged by all of it and would like nothing better but to see these knuckleheads get what they deserve. Get informed, let your friends know what is going on and let's shut these bastards down. It's not even close to being too late. By being informed and vocal we can knock this one out of the park!!!

Thanks for reading. ***end rant***

[RTG]

Here's the deal, as quick and dirty as I can make it:

The "Center For Biological Diversity" is an eco-litigous group meaning that they make their money off of suing people, companies and the government for "environmental oversights". While protecting endangered species and sensitive habitats is without a doubt critically important, we are talking about a group behind many of "those" nightmare stories that you read about. Someone being sued and losing their home over a "possible" sighting of a kangaroo rat, the EPA rolling over in frivolous lawsuits and losing millions of your tax dollars, etc. etc.. This is a really well-known group not for what they do for the environment, but for their constant leaching off of the system and only settling when their pockets are fully lined with fresh new bills (over $1.1 MILLION in "legal settlement" in 2009 alone!). These are not good people. These are not "patrons of the environment". These are money hungry lawyers under the veil of a "green" name with an agenda focused only on an entirely different kind of green...money!!! Think I am lying or exaggerating? Then go ahead and read these articles...

Writers on the Range: Extreme green

Chilton Ranch Lawsuit

more background to Chilton Ranch Lawsuit

And there are many more stories just like those!!! It's truly unbelievable and it absolutely PAINS me to think that my tax dollars are being spent to feed these leaches. Ridiculous.


The CFBD originally sued the DFG noting that while farm raised fish having a negative impact on endangered species had never been documented, hatchery raised fish pose an inherent, unnatural risk to endangered and protected species in the surrounding areas and that this risk needs to assessed and mitigated if necessary. This includes both the time the fish spend in the hatchery as well as the time they spend in the bodies of water in which they are planted. Water quality is not at all the issue here. After filing the initial lawsuit, the CFBD subsequently included private hatcheries, private lakes, and just for s___s and giggles, they also decided to make it a sweeping rampage that would include ANYBODY that maintain fish in their lakes into the lawsuit. It's not just Irvine/SARL/Corona/LNL. It's Perris, Silverwood, DVL, Skinner, Barrett, your local golf course, AND YOU!!! Have a pond in your backyard with fish in it? Well, you'll have to hire a certified biologist to come onto your property so that he/she can do an environmental assessment. If he/she finds that in ANY way, your pond interacts with an endangered or protected species (think about what "interacts" means and you'll see that its a very loosey goosey term that lawyers can have all kinds of fun with), you'll be subject to further assessment and perhaps having to mitigate. Mitigation may include draining your pond or killing your fish, OR, even better, it could include now having to care and set up a permanent mitigation site on your property!!! Do all of that, and yup, YOU'LL STILL NEED A FISHING LICENSE TO FISH IN YOUR OWN BACKYARD!!!!! Not to mention that DFG will be welcome on your property whenever they wish for "inspection" and nope, they won't be stocking any fish. You better not be fishing with more than 2 rods (and you better have a stamp for the second one. You can keep all of your license stuff in the kitchen drawer and grab it when they come knocking!)!!!

But maybe you're like me and you don't own a pond. You may be thinking, "Well, I buy a license every year and I don't mind paying a few extra bucks to go fish at a pay lake" right? WRONG! This is NOT a simple "raise the prices at the gate" type situation. A survey conducted during this process showed that more than 60% of pay lake attendees do not have a fishing license! If even half of those people stayed home because they had to purchase a license for mom, dad, grandma, grandpa, etc., your favorite pay lake will be forced to close it's doors. And then you can throw on top of that the insane assessment and mitigation fees and really drive in the nail in the coffin. This is without a doubt a "businesses shut down and ALL California stocking programs are shut down" type situation. And that would be a best case scenario. Imagine, with the state budget being the fiasco that it is, that Lake Perris, Silverwood, or any of those bodies of water that we all love to visit are now hit with a 1-2 punch of: 1) they need to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on biological assessment and possibly millions on mitigation and 2) the fish that they used to plant are simply no longer available. Thinking about what that would do to the southern California fishing scene sickens me. I can't even begin to picture it and I really would rather not.

This really is a big deal and can absolutely be thought of as freshwater fishing's version of the MLPA. Everyone that can be, needs to be involved as this will potentially hit not only the pay lakes, but everyone involved in this industry from tackle shop owners, manufacturers and without a doubt, anglers. I'm outraged by all of it and would like nothing better but to see these knuckleheads get what they deserve. Get informed, let your friends know what is going on and let's shut these bastards down. It's not even close to being too late. By being informed and vocal we can knock this one out of the park!!!

Thanks for reading. ***end rant***

Pretty accurate, but wrong about one thing. You do not, and will not, need a fishing license to fish on a private lake or pond that is NOT hydrologically connected to state waters. Period. The Corona Lakes and Santa Ana River Lakes of the state are hydrologically connected and that is why a fishing license will be required.
If you own a lake or pond that is wholly located within private property, and is not connected to a river, stream or creek, then you do not need a fishing license to fish there. Look it up yourself in the Fish and Game Code.
Don't blame Fish and Game, blame these private fishing operators who have been skirting the system for years so you can catch fish in a heavily stocked lake, raised to grossly over-sized proportions so you can pretend to be a real fisherman.